Will higher unemployment drive economic relocalization and cultural renaissance?

Posted by Leon Haller on June 04, 2011, 11:43 AM | #

Important questions, good insights, but inadequately demonstrated conclusions.

1. There are far too many persons (esp nonwhites) enjoying way too high living standards from govt work.

2. Govt is mostly the enemy of prosperity (here persons like Mises and Rothbard should be studied, even if their Jewishness offends some persons), but not only due to its own unproductive and unnecessary employees. It is govt provision of non-real ‘public goods’ (eg, postal services) and ownership of assets (eg, airports) which build incredible inefficiencies into the economy. The solution is massive privatization.

3. Govt is also the enemy of prosperity because of the tremendous costs caused by needless regulations, especially in the labor markets, but also including the very systems of taxation imposed across the West. The solution is massive deregulation, and tax simplification.

4. Govt regulations have the ancillary effect of creating much artificial private sector employment (eg, labor/most torts/civil rights lawyers, ‘diversity’ counselors, corporate ‘govt relations’ personnel, tax preparers, etc). Such employees do not add anything to real living standards.

5. Govt-controlled monetary systems are the source of both working-class destroying inflation (a hidden tax which redistributes wealth from common savers to, first, govt itself; second, to the ‘private’ banks; third, to the largest corporations, especially highly leveraged ones), as well as painful cycles of recession and worse (which in turn only serve to accelerate both the delegitimization of capitalism, as well as the growth of govt domination over economies).

6. Govt pseudo-deregulations first in the 80s and later in the 90s encouraged a massive financialization of the US economy (also the British, I think, as well as perhaps those of other white countries). This over-emphasis on finance led to much needless destruction of Western industry - torn apart to create “financial value”, but rarely economic value - and its concurrent outsourcing to Third World countries, like Mexico, India, and of course, China, as well as to an economically harmful (esp in the long run) concentration of ‘cognitive’ resources (ie, smart people) in finance, as opposed to technical areas of production, and industrial management.

7. Massive immigration of badly educated and lower-mean-IQ specimens bodes ill on multiple levels for long term economic performance (as do domestic dysgenic trends, from early 20th century European conflicts, to female careerism and its ensuing white fertility collapse).

8. All that noted, however, let us not adopt the economically illiterate stance of so many “salt of the Earth” types, from Christians to agrarians to paleoconservatives to Laborites to nationalists, who think the “real work” is only or mainly physical, and that managers and traders and middlemen serve no economic function. These days, most real work is done behind desks, and in laboratories - which is why whites are found there, and Mexicans have the hammers and shovels.

9. It is not clear how “the collapse” will occur, or whether it will occur at all. It could be public debt driven, esp if the US dollar loses its reserve currency status (a distinct intermediate term possibility). More likely is this “new normal” above-mentioned: permanently higher structural unemployment, higher mean inflation, worsening public services, eventually higher taxes. In other words, extended economic sclerosis, and continually declining living standards (but not necessarily any more sharp drops).

10. This trans-Western decline, perhaps more pronounced in the US and Britain (though Cameron is doing a lot right in focusing on ‘austerity’) than in better managed countries like Canada and Australia, or more industrious ones like Germany and Denmark, will probably aid the Right more than the Left (eg, 2010 US elections), and might turn public opinion against immigration - or not: nothing has been done in the US, which is still accepting 1.7mil legals per year, despite the worst real employment picture since the Great Depression.

11. I highly doubt there will be any turn to local food production. Far more likely, irate US taxpayers will demand serious reductions in farm subsidies, esp for idiotic ‘biofuels’, as well possible restrictions on food exports. The US, Canada, France, maybe Aus/NZ, are in no danger whatsoever of having to turn to local produce (mush as “slow foodies” may fervently wish it). I’m not sure about the rest of Europe (except that Nordic Europe will almost certainly continue to have the financial wherewithal to import what food it wishes). It is in the Third World where in the coming decades there will be massive hardships related to insufficient food (food price inflation was a major cause of the recent “Arab Spring” revolts).

12. Prolonged hardship may or may not force people to “grow up”, in a conservative sense. It might just mean more elected socialists looting their way through whatever remains of private wealth. It all depends on the quality of leadership. Overall, tough times are electorally better for the nationalist Right, among conservative whites, and the socialist Left, among liberal whites and nonwhites. That racial/ideological polarization, already evident and growing, will be good for WN.

13. In Troubles or not, we do not need to create a religion, nor will such an endeavor be successful. We are forever past the Axial Age. Many of our people will be returning to their ageless faith - not the sad myths of the pagans, but the joyful and highly intellectualized truths of Christianity, the traditional religion of the West. Our task is to align ourselves with that religious return, so that WN is acceptable to Christianity - indeed, we ought to be the staunchest defenders of the faith, the better to subvert its contemporary errors, which have unnecessarily and heretically rendered it little more than ‘theistic liberalism’. Indeed, the faith, properly understood, demands national and racial loyalty as natural expressions of pious character. The good man is defined by loyalty, to God first and foremost, obviously, but also to other orders of creation - to parents, to wife, to kin, to community, to nation, and to race. Of course, the scope of lesser loyalties is bounded by moral law, but that law imposes no duty of race-mixing, nor of passivity in the face of occupationist regime-encouraged alien dispossession and race-replacement. Quite the opposite, in fact.

Every epoch is unique. Peoples and civilizations must win themselves anew, adjusting ideological emphases and survival tactics. Our collective gene-line created a great mode of being in the world under an ancient alliance of Throne and Altar. For those who would save the West, that it might remain something greater than a huddled and besieged White Zion, our greatest task is to forge an alliance of Race and Altar. It can be done intellectually, and it must be done strategically.

Posted by anymouse on June 04, 2011, 01:45 PM | #

Businesses are looking to hire, but the workers they are looking to hire are not there in the abundance that they want them to be

Bullshit.

I know former electronic engineers employed as technicians ($18 p/hr).  I know former technicians employed as installers ($12-14 p/hr).  I know former installers employed part-time in sweaty, greasy In-n-Out burger joints (minimum wage).  All working their asses off to stay employed and outdoing their competitors in kissing the boss’ ass.  Yes, I’m quite aware of the “narrative” put out by Business and its capitalist-Republican ideologues seeking to explain the above:  Most or all of these people were marginal employees in their former occupations.  Uh huh.  Right.

Quick checks in the Orange County Register and Los Angeles Time’s classifieds shows a heavy uptick in temporary jobs compared to years past.  The permanent job applicant must provide a salary history, be willing to work overtime and on any shift, provide his own transportation for field work, sign on to “just-in-time” production and other multitasking “crisis management” philosophies, must subject himself to extensive personal background checks, etc.  All perfectly normal when the economy turns to shit.  Couple this to the fact that “valuing diversity” is code for “non-whites preferred.”

Just like unions, businesses want something for nothing.

Posted by Lee John Barnes on June 04, 2011, 02:36 PM | #

The coming crash offers us an opprtunity if we do what is needed, which is to form organisations and groups that directly assist our people during the period of the troubles.

We need to copy the Hamas social activism model that they used to win over the Palestinian people and start projects and community groups that delivers food, clothing, legal help, financial assistance, lobby groups, community projects, food banks, soup kitchens, housing projects etc etc to white individuals,families and communities that will hep our people through the period of collapse.

Then when the collapse ends - we remain seen by the people as their helpers and liberators.

They will the trust us enough to vote for us.

That way nationalism goes from the margins into the mainstream.

If anyone cannot see that this is the stretegy we need to follow, and that we need to start preparing for it right now, then they are a fucking idiot.

Posted by Revolution Harry on June 04, 2011, 04:02 PM | #

Hard bass? Are you serious? The first link you provided was to something called ‘Nazi Techno’. That’s going to work a treat.

The reason hard bass never caught on here is because it’s awful. The original house scene in the UK subsequently split into numerous sub-genres. The closest to hard bass was the hard house/core scene and that’s been and gone I’m afraid. Those involved with that scene were mainly drug addled idiots who everyone I knew (I was a club promoter - mainly house, deep house and chilled/balearic stuff) viewed with derision. Associating itself with that scene would do nationalism no good at all, either with youths in general or the wider public.

The idea that middle aged nationalists can somehow promote or get involved with ‘youth culture’ is delusional. Youth culture is just that, created and enjoyed by young people.

It’s here we see a fatal flaw in the ‘cultural nationalism’ approach. Many native British youths have been bought up in multicultural areas. At the same time they have been systematically overwhelmed (brainwashed) into thinking that other ethnic cultures are cool and edgy. Many British youths are now more likely to be going to drum ‘n’ bass, hip hop or two step events. This is now ‘British’ youth culture whether they are black, white or brown. The idea that a political party can somehow dictate what a nation’s culture should be is, again, deluded. A great deal of damage has already been done and cultural nationalism will, essentially, do nothing to reverse that.

Posted by jrackell on June 04, 2011, 04:05 PM | #

You all need to read Kevin Carson.  Presumptuous but brief.

“Organization Theory”  http://mutualist.blogspot.com/2005/12/studies-in-anarchist-theory-of.html

“Studies in mutualist economic theory” http://www.mutualist.org/id47.html

Posted by Robert Reis on June 04, 2011, 04:59 PM | #

From Sweden:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zN32eCzIv1U&feature=player_embedded

Posted by Lee John Barnes on June 04, 2011, 05:15 PM | #

I provided the link to show the diversity of muscial genres in the nationalist dance music scene and to illustrate the type of music to people on this board who have no idea of what any of it sounds like.

I am sorry if you are too fucking stupid to understand that.

Hard Bass has ’ not caught on ’ in the UK is because as a genre it is located in Russia and the Eastern European region, not in the UK.

There has been no Hard Bass scene in the UK as it has never been exported to the UK.

As for the Hard Bass secene itself - the scene is massive and growing all across Eastern Europe - take the time to some fucking research and check the facts out.

http://praguemonitor.com/2011/06/01/právo-czech-neo-nazis-provoke-hard-bass

As for the idea that Hard Bass should associate with the established club scene is the most idiotic suggestion I have ever heard - the UK club scene run by reds / gangsters who hate nationalism.

Nationalist Hard Bass music or night have never been heard or held in any UK clubs - so you are talking shite.

Have I said that nationalists should run the UK Hard Bass scene ?

No, I have not.

What would be ideal is that the kids run the scene for themselves and nationalists attend events to sell / give away propaganda to recruit the kids into the political groups they like.

Hard Bass aint black you fucking idiot, nor is it ethnic.

White people make the majority of club music and the Hard Bass is run by the kids and DJs who make the music - the Hard Bass scene in Russia aint run by blacks you fucking twat.

Its run by white Russian kids.

As for the cultural nationalist issue - what the fuck does that have to do with anything.

I am not debating cultural nationalism you idiot, I am talking about the Russian nationalist club music scene.

Cultural Nationalism has nothing to do with any of the issues around the nationalist music genres such as Hard Bass in Russia.

The Russian kids make the music as they want to have a good time and express nationalist ideas as they do so.

The idea that a political party cannot dictate a culture is pathetic rubbish - the laws define our culture already via Ofcom, the PCC and other groups that monitor and define what we see on TV and read in the papers.

You are so fucking stupid you can only be a red.

Only a red or an idiot would ignore or attack the fact that Russian kids have managed to create a new nationalist music scene that allows them to recruit new members and supporters from kids who would not normally have anything to do with nationalism as a political movement.

You are a red.

Fuck off.

Posted by Anymouse on June 04, 2011, 05:22 PM | #

To dissolve, submerge, and cause to disappear the political or governmental system in the economic system by reducing, simplifying, decentralizing and suppressing, one after another, all the wheels of this great machine, which is called the Government or the State.—Proudhon, General Idea of the Revolution

If governments didn’t exist they would be brought into existence for the purpose of acquiring advantage.  Government, politics, and political systems are about acquiring and maximizing power and control of propaganda. In the final analysis labor and business interests are mutually opposed.  Both will seize any tool available to protect and maximize benefits for themselves.  Negotiation and compromise are but “nice-sounding” memes used to mask the eternal state of war between these mutually opposed interests.  Any contract resulting from these is merely a temporary hand tool.  The strongest party controls it.  The ultimate weapon for the weakest party is the “Samson Option.” Is there one available?  Do the weakest have the will to use it?  Will they blink?  Anything less than the will to go Samson is recognized by the strongest party as bullshit.

Posted by Graham_Lister on June 04, 2011, 05:33 PM | #

Interesting topic

Yes I’m not really down with this love of the right-wing, dog eat dog, neo-liberal economic/social model. If an ethnically and culturally homogenous society is valuable then it is a collective good. It cannot be defended, in any serious way, by the nostrums of liberal individualism. That would be a category error. Hayekian liberalism in this context is dumb beyond belief.

The Scandinavian model has produced high levels of prosperity and stable societies with high levels of social capital/social solidarity. Please note, our American friends, they are not ‘socialist’; they are market economies but with generally smart policies to build both social and economic capital. Unlike the UK with its housing bubble producing the illusion of prosperity, a never-ending population of immigrants in generally low-paid jobs to generate ‘economic growth’ and the organised spivary of finance capital.

Let me ask a simple question to people especially of the more libertarian bent. Imagine you can live in a time like the USA in 1954 or in the USA of 2004. As a white I would pick a 1954 style society every time. Guess what marginal tax rates for the wealthy were up to 90% - Government was pretty big back then too.

So what has happened since 1954? - Well it is often noted that the ‘right’ won the economic arguments and the ‘left’ the cultural ones. But as Adam Curtis argues his documentary “The Century of the Self” these developments are two sides of the same coin. The coin of individualistic liberalism. To put it crudely the ‘left’ version of this ideology undermines traditional social and cultural norms. So do it in the road if it feels good, be a LSD dropping libertine homosexual, be a sluttish woman that fucks a different black every night if you want to etc., it’s your ‘right’ as an sovereign individual. And on the ‘right’ well if can we can cynically profit from something we will…so let’s go with the trashy mass-culture (you want porn 24/7 here you go) and if it keeps the profits flowing, yes lets have the millions of Mexicans please (and fuck Euro-America, if it ends up destroying them so long as we make a buck who cares?). It’s your ‘right’ as a sovereign individual to make as much money as possible – not matter how toxic the effects are upon the common good and the historical well of social capital. Markets can have extremely negative consequences, they can radically undermine the genuine things of value that sustain a healthy culture. Markets must serve the health of society not the other way around. Knowing the price of everything but the value of nothing is a big part of the reason why Western world is in the position it now faces.

Clinton and Bush Junior are separated by secondary ‘expressive’ issues but on all the key functional issues are in agreement (the two sides of the political class have far more in common with each other than with with us plebs both functionally and ideologically).  The political class of America is now, more or less openly, a hostile class to their own population. Right and left liberalism are two cheeks on the same behind – the same butt that is defecating all over the genuine long-term well-being of the vast majority of Euro-Americans.

I have lived in both Minnesota and Texas and the vast majority of everyday Euro-Americans I encountered were polite, decent, helpful, civil and generally nice people (far more that in England which is the most culturally and socially degraded nation in the Western world). The demographic crisis facing them is real and more pronounced that in any other Western nation, but the USA is practically a colony of Israel these days due both to our Jewish ‘friends’ and self-serving traitorous elites so the longer-term prospects look rather bleak.

Any ethnocentric politics, to my mind, must be build around the ‘radical center’ than can appeal to both men and women, the blue-collar worker and the professional. Intelligently collectivist and communitarian, profoundly contemptuous of every form of the destructive ultra-liberalism (right and left) that, thus far, has been the evermore powerful and hegemonic shaper of modernity. A synthesis of the best of right and left traditions in order to protect our collective and individual well-being, understanding the profound interdependence of the latter on the former, and looks beyond mere survival to our renewed flourishing as European people. A politics and culture which from the lowliest street-sweeper to the highest scientist recoginses their profound value and dignity because they are OUR people.

And just to finish, should we ever live in genuinely revolutionary times, personally I would not be unhappy to see the rounding up every ‘follower’ of that Jewish bitch Ann Rand (aka Alisa Zinov’yevna Rosenbaum whom, of course, pushed the idea, for the goyim at least, that we have no collective identity, history, interests and so on and thoughts of such are the highest form of evil), and the administration of desperately needed ‘retrospective abortions’ for the self-styled ‘objectivists’.

Posted by Lee John Barnes on June 04, 2011, 05:44 PM | #

This is the only UK site I can find for hard bass fans in the UK - note even they say its a brand new musical genre coming from Russia.

http://soundcloud.com/hardbasscrew

There has been no large Hard Bass scene in the Uk, as the scene is in Russia and has not come to the UK yet.

The Hard Trance scene is not Hard Bass - Hard Bass is the Russian variant of Dutch Gabba, which is also a nationalist club music genre. 

For a so called ‘ex-club promoter’, you know fuck all about the Hard Bass scene.

I know plenty of DJ’s, promoters and others involved in the Rave, House, Big Beat, Techno etc scenes and none of them have ever heard of Russian Hard Bass.

The only forms of Hard Bass in the UK derive from the Russian nationalist version of Hard Bass that evolved from Dutch Gabba.

The fact is that a white kids in the UK club scene have already started to adopt the Hard Bass genre and have started to hold Hard Bass nights - which is even better as the kids who get into the scene will start to get into the Russian Hard Bass scene for most of the music and hence will come into contact with russian nationalist ideas in the Russian Hard Bass scene.

Posted by Grimoire on June 04, 2011, 05:56 PM | #

These comments are excellent.

Leon, nice piece - you should expand this.
I like where Kievsky goes with his ideas, thanks Soren.

Revolution Harry, your right - but we are not a political party, lets not get pulled into that dead and controlled way of thinking. That is what we have to overcome, not enlist in. We are a social movement that encompasses all native Europeans, or all people everywhere, to go live in their own countries as their own masters. This type of movement, -540 degree’s counter to everything that has come before - has a possibility of universal attraction. We should brainstorm a new idea, totally unique, to attract those who sense ‘everything is wrong’, as youth do openly. We need awareness that musical or cultural genius is found first among the young. You cannot control or manufacture honest creative expression…but you can come across and recognize it, and when you do find it, it is cultural dynamite. All I’m saying is be open to it…you do come across it if you are very lucky and have open eyes.

There is no reason a black or Indian artist who advocates returning to Africa or India or the Moon shouldn’t be recognized, respected, encouraged and promoted. We’d be insane not to. We’d be insane to turn away anyone who shares our basic beliefs - immigrants go home and clean up your own mess….corrupt politicians, your ticket is invalid, compromised political systems - we can’t hear you, armed police surveillance state - you’ve been hacked, national military - hows the holiday in Afghanistan? Cultural Marxists - fuck off we’re sick of you…and btw. say hello to my little friend.

There is the possibility of a end run around the system

Posted by Revolution Harry on June 04, 2011, 06:05 PM | #

I clicked on your link and it starts out ‘I am the DJ, the DJ from hell’. Says it all really. Most people I know wouldn’t touch it with a barge pole. There’s nothing new here. It’s the same old hard core techno speeded up a little and a bit more menacing. I know all I need to know about Hard Bass thanks very much. It won’t catch on here for the same reason Gabba didn’t. It’s rubbish. That any ‘nationalist’ wants to associate themselves with this garbage beggars belief.

Posted by Revolution Harry on June 04, 2011, 06:42 PM | #

Apologies for posting this on the wrong thread.

As I said, I’ve just seen your other reply. Most of it is garbled nonsense but I’ll pick out a few highlights.

There has been no Hard Bass scene in the UK as it has never been exported to the UK.

I’m aware of that. You suggested that nationalists should ‘organise a Hard Bass gig and have a laugh’. That’s what I responded to, albeit on the wrong thread.

As for the Hard Bass secene itself - the scene is massive and growing all across Eastern Europe - take the time to some fucking research and check the facts out.

I’m aware of that, when did I deny it?

Hard Bass aint black you fucking idiot, nor is it ethnic.

Whose the ‘idiot’? Where did I suggest that Hard Bass was black?

White people make the majority of club music and the Hard Bass is run by the kids and DJs who make the music - the Hard Bass scene in Russia aint run by blacks you fucking twat.

Now you’re getting ridiculous. The Russian Hard Bass scene run by blacks. Where did I say that? The idea that the majority of club music is by whites is highly debatable at the least but let’s leave that aside.

As for the cultural nationalist issue - what the fuck does that have to do with anything.

Read what I said. You obviously didn’t understand it.

The idea that a political party cannot dictate a culture is pathetic rubbish.

So you’re going to dictate our culture are you? Dream on.

You are a red.

Yawn. How predictable. It’s the reason I gave up on you a long time ago. That and your close association to the screamingly obvious state controlled plant and freemason Nick Griffin. The real controllers of this country and elsewhere run the left and the right, the reds and the blues. Surely you’ve worked that out Lee?

Posted by Graham_Lister on June 04, 2011, 07:06 PM | #

@LBJ - honestly I’m sorry to seem so snotty towards you but you seem like a dinosaur that willfully wishes to forever be in a tiny, irrelevant, self-made, sub-cultural ghetto.

I can just see it now:

“Mrs Average can I interest you or your children in learning more about white culture”

“Such as?”

“Well I was thinking a neo-Nazi techo rave might be a good start”

“No thanks”

Mrs Average thinks to her self ‘care in the community’ has went far too far.

Please read this essay on the real significance of ‘youth culture’

I provide some selected highlights below.

The world displayed in the culture of youth is a world from which the parents have absconded—as these days, they generally have. This culture aims to present youth as the goal and fulfillment of human life, rather than a transitional phase that must be cast off as an impediment once mature commitment calls. Youth culture promotes experiences that can be obtained without undertaking the burdens of responsibility, work, child rearing, and marriage. Hence sex, and especially sex divorced from any long-term commitment, becomes of paramount importance; so do experiences that involve no cost in terms of education, moral discipline, hardship, or love—the paradigm being drug taking, which has the added advantage that it shuts out the adult world completely and replaces it with a cloud of wishful dreams, the very same wishful dreams that float across the screen of MTV. When youth culture invokes the adult world, it is only to pour scorn on it as a delusive fiction or a source of tyrannical constraint…

Pop music will not save anyone or anything.

Posted by Revolution Harry on June 04, 2011, 07:35 PM | #

Grimoire, I can’t disagree with anything you said in your comment. That said there are certain dynamics that have to be taken into account when considering youth culture in this country. We are all the targets for ‘perception management’ which is a polite way of saying brainwashing. The British elite excel at this. Young people are particularly subjected to endless multicultural propaganda in a variety of forms, musical culture being only one of them. The whole business from the record labels to radio stations to magazines is carefully controlled and almost impossible to penetrate. I can remember the storm that erupted when Morrissey suggested that Britain was losing its cultural identity.

If a youth movement that deals with issues such as mass immigration, loss of cultural identity etc does evolve then fine. However I don’t think it will be created by middle aged nationalists whether its ‘organising Hard Bass gigs’ or any other type of music. What young people need is easy to digest information from which they can begin to think and act for themselves. In this respect I do agree with LJB in that we need less impenetrable ‘philosophy’ and more well thought out articles specifically targeted at young people that may well serve as a catalyst for other things.

Posted by Grimoire on June 04, 2011, 08:13 PM | #

Revolution Harry:
                    All true. However, consider the possibility that the present state of things is a house of cards. There are windows now and then that if opened can allow a slight wind to blow down the entire structure. We have to be looking for that, learning the signs, staying open to possibilities.

Everyone has good ideas, I don’t suggest change their outlook, just widening their perspective and allowing openness to new ideas and opportunities.

Posted by Lurker on June 04, 2011, 09:46 PM | #

Seems to me that dance music is much like the rest of mass culture. At the pinnacle are the black figureheads we are invited to worship. In every other respect its whites doing the work.

Are blacks in any way represented in their ‘correct’ numbers in the ranks of DJs, producers, engineers, technicians, musicians etc etc? And who designs install, rig the lights, sound etc for clubs, live shows. No blacks to be seen dirtying their hands with any of that.

Blacks, pretty much, are there only as the headline performers.

Its a bit like F1, is it ‘black’ because Lewis Hamilton is black? You’d almost think so from the way its promoted but he is an outlier if not a deliberate plant, how many people are fooled by that. F1 is white through and through, lets make a respectful nod to the Japanese though.

Dance music is black largely as its marketed that way. So I dont think it would a huge leap to have at least some sub-genres defined as explicitly as white.

Of course in a roundabout way, Im just agreeing with Revolution Harry. As in so many other cases dance music is all about perception management.

Posted by Lee John Barnes on June 05, 2011, 03:13 AM | #

There are some truly thick people on this site.

Hard Bass is not for ‘normal people’ it is for kids.

If you cannot understand that kids form their own sub cultures to differntiate them from the rest of adult society then you are an idiot.

This is one of the new musical sub cultures to go mainstream which is nationalist - and you wankers want to sneer at it and sneer at the nationalist kids involved in it.

Fuck you.

They are the future of nationalism, you wernt even the past.

Those that think blacks are the ‘figureheads’ of dance music, know nothing of it.

Nordics are the main figureheads in dance music - mainly Swiss and German and English white DJ’s making music for an audience around 99 % white.

There are sub genres of dance music that have a ‘black’ image eg drum and bass - but drum and bass aint Hard Bass just as Big Beat aint Garage. Even Drum and Bass is a white dominated genre as the majority of DJ’s making Drum and Bass are white and so are the audiences.

Urban is the black genre for blacks and even then the majority od DJ’s are still white.

” Dance music is all about perception management ” ha ha ha ha and there was the kids thinking it was all about having a good time.

Yet again I will state that nationalists will not organise Hard Bass gigs, the kids will organose their own gigs.

Though the nationalists could support some young white DJ’s with funds to get them trained up on the decks and as technicians to help organise the movement and make their own music.

They wont do that though - as most nationalists in this country are incapable of innovation, all they can do is think like fucking lemmings and mimic what every other nationalist has done and hence fail time after time.

As for culture - culture is primarily a product of government via ;

media regulation that controls what we read and watch eg the BBC charter, Ofcom, the PCC, the film regulators who classify films by age / content and hence ddefine their audience

grants to the arts council who fund theatres and cultural groups

grants to local councils to fund cultural events

what kids are taught in schools - which is how the majority of national cultures are made / destroyed

etc etc etc

Every government controls culture by controlling who runs the media and what they are allowed to publish and produce for the public.

The idea dinosaurs like you Graham can offer anything to this debate is laughable.

The fact you try and use links to other dinosaurs like yourself to back up your reactionary crap is predictable.

I have already responded to the questions why I included the link to the nazi techno music in the thread above as an answer to the idiot Harry who made the same facile point.

Go back and re-read it.

The fact reactionary, pseudo-intellectual, failed, worshippers of the dead hate this music is good.

Everything they like is a total waste of time.

They follow the failures of the past without deviation and think that doing so offers us a model for the future.

Fucking zombie nationalists.

Thankfully the kids have had enough of your zombie politics shit and have escaped the stupidity that you worship. 

Those who know fuck all about the dance genre should shut up.

Posted by Bill on June 05, 2011, 04:09 AM | #

Sheer genius in the Guardian today by Andrew Rawnsley 5th June 2011.

Read his piece here….Thatcher’s dream becomes a nightmare for a jilted generation The goal of a property-owning democracy will wither and die if Britain doesn’t start building many more homes.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/jun/05/andrew-rawnsley-house-prices-construction

Rawnsley pens a lengthy article about the acute crisis of shortage of housing in Britain.  Having skimmed through the article twice, I still cannot believe not once did he allude to overcrowding, demographics, population growth and of course the dreaded ‘I’ word.

To accomplish this feat is sheer genius, or is it simply liberal disconnect?

Posted by Dirty Bull on June 05, 2011, 05:01 AM | #

Right you are Bill.

To anyone with a brain it is incontestable that the massive, uncontrolled immigration of the past 60 years and in particular the madness of New Labour has well and truly fucked up this country good and proper.
Anglo-Saxons haven’t been reproducing themselves for the past 40 years.Ergo, sans immigration, we would have an actual *housing surplus* in Britain right now, and not having young couples human sacrificied and our economy banjaxed on an ocean of debt - well, I suppose that’s the price you have to pay for thick-lipped, fat-assed dumb black African ass-wipers in care homes as the Labourites are apt to scream.
  What gets me is this.Put the racial and genetic concerns over immigration to one side for the moment (although they are overwhelming and of prime importance).This country is cursed by having tens of thousands (literally) of ‘economists’ and ‘economic experts’ and yet, and yet they are purblind to the simple and obvious destruction uncontrolled immigration is causing to Britain by inflating the housing bubble - which was the ultimate source of all our woes.
  Even the simple and obvious fact (there are 5 million on the waiting list, there are 3 million unemployed, yet there are 5 million wogs), eludes their tiny brains.

Posted by Kievsky on June 05, 2011, 08:01 AM | #

Every epoch is unique. Peoples and civilizations must win themselves anew, adjusting ideological emphases and survival tactics. Our collective gene-line created a great mode of being in the world under an ancient alliance of Throne and Altar. For those who would save the West, that it might remain something greater than a huddled and besieged White Zion, our greatest task is to forge an alliance of Race and Altar. It can be done intellectually, and it must be done strategically.

Great conclusion to the comment.

You expressed doubt about a return to local agriculture.  I live in a town that was a farm town from before its incorporation in 1699, until about 50 years ago.  I live in a state (Connecticut) that was a “plantation state” from colonial times until about 80 years ago.  There is still a massive amount of arable land here, and we have plenty of rainfall.

Now there are some processes in motion here in the US that are relatively new and will take some time to mature.  You think there’s going to be a slow decline.  Have you heard of “the Boomerang Generation?”  Those are the 20 something and 30 something and even 40 somethings who are back living at home with their parents.  There are a lot of kids in this age group making 10 bucks an hour doing retail.  This is not enough even to live independently, much less support a family.  The cost of living went up but wages are very very stagnant.

And they don’t do anything at all to cushion the blow—for example having affordable housing in the same area as mass transit and the same area as jobs.  White American kids are stuck in the automobile slum, up a cul de sac in a cement filled SUV without a fillup.  They are increasingly having to rely on the kindness of family.

If the economy recovers, the Boomerang generation might be able to move out and let off the pressure.  If the economy doesn’t recover, the Boomerangs are going to be reduced even more to beggar-dom unless they do something—ANYTHING, that might produce some income.

One of these things is farming.  I think a town like mine, if it has a lot of unemployed Boomerangers, will start a “town farm.”  I know the selectman (a farmer himself), and he thinks of this idea.  It’s too early to do this because people are not yet desperate.  However, when the motivation is there, things will be set in motion.  A town farm would give several farmers a chance to pool resources, and Boomerangers need only bring their labor.  If it did well, it could easily spread.  The Boomerangers could take larger and larger plots, or start farming their parents’ land.  They could also be doing “processing” here—canning, dehydrating, smoking et cetera.

We’re going to have to see the value in equipment sharing, too—tractor, truck and car sharing.

Connecticut people would certainly get a lot thinner and better looking if they produced their own food for themselves.  We have our share of “people of walmart” here.  The worst thing to ever happen to the lower classes was that so many of them no longer need to do manual labor of any sort.  I dream of the day when we turn the people of walmart out into the fields to dig potatoes.  I am so ready for that.  Then we won’t “need” Mexicans any more.

Posted by Foundation on June 05, 2011, 08:26 AM | #

Graham_Lister said:

’.. far more that [sic] in England which is the most culturally and socially degraded nation in the Western world’

Though it pains me to say it Graham that statement is correct, on both counts. Oh how I wish it were different but we’ve been so awfully betrayed as a people. The common folk were abused for centuries by the wealthy and titled elite and sometime during the Industrial Revolution our culture died. When the political elite took over in the latter part of the 19th century our society was shattered. Enter the do-gooders, the social scientists and the Marxists.

One last opportunity came after WWII. The people were again fully united by the war and they deserved the return of their culture. Not just for the huge sacrifice made but in recognition that were it not for the incredible bonds of kinship this island people still possessed the war would have been lost in 1940. What they got however was mass immigration. England is slightly smaller than Louisiana, a mid-sized state in the US of A. We didn’t stand a chance.

Both socialists and capitalists have spent the last six decades destroying what little remains of our way of life. The payback will mean civil war. I, and others like me, are preparing for that war. We do not suffer the illusion of winning. We calculate our losses at 100 per cent for the first 2500 patriots. We’re hoping it will finally wake the people when they see large numbers of their kinfolk dead on the streets. We have friends in the US who are willing to supply us with arms.

What greater honour is there than to die for England, to give the unborn the freedom to forever live, love, laugh and cry with their own kind, in England. Our ancestors did no less.

Posted by Grimoire on June 05, 2011, 02:37 PM | #

Foundation: Build your strength, don’t waste it on gestures of desperation. Guerrilla warfare has proven that patience, technique, obtain success. In Germany we send the better of our nazi youth to enlist in community service,  ambulance, fire departments, neighborhood security detail in liaison with police, to obtain useful skills and logistics intelligence.
A quiet mobilization can have dramatic psychological effect.

Posted by Revolution Harry on June 05, 2011, 04:35 PM | #

Lee, I was tempted to respond in detail to your last ramble but really, what’s the point. You obviously have little understanding of dance music or who makes it. Most kids in this country are more likely to look to Ibiza rather than Belgrade and I think you’ll find that the French, Italians and Spanish are contributing every bit as much as the English, Germans and Nordics.

I didn’t say that ‘black people’ were the ‘figureheads’ of dance music but they are still heavily represented whether that’s in traditional house music, with it’s American roots, or the various sub-genres that have sprung up from it. If you think that 99% of kids at a drum ‘n’ bass night are white then you haven’t been to one in Birmingham or Wolverhampton. The point being that the ethnic make up of the area is reflected in the dance music that is successful in that area.

One point though. You say:

Yet again I will state that nationalists will not organise Hard Bass gigs, the kids will organise their own gigs.

And yet you previously suggested that:

If nationalists want to win over teenagers - then this is how you do it ;

You organise a Hard Bass gig and have a laugh !

If you’re going to get into the promoting game then make sure you’ve got plenty of money to lose. You’re going to need it.

For the record I didn’t say that ‘dance music is all about perception management’. I did say that we are all subjected to it by various means and methods and young people are particularly targeted. One of the ways they are targeted is through the music industry. Here’s a couple of primers on the subject.

http://revolutionharry.blogspot.com/2010/02/frankfurt-school-and-radio-project.html

http://revolutionharry.blogspot.com/2009/11/brainwashing-how-british-use-media-for.html

Posted by Grimoire on June 05, 2011, 04:37 PM | #

Kievsky: thank you, your article and comment help show a wider perspective. People who work land and grow the stuff that feeds our people, at the end of the day are the bedrock of nationalism.

Posted by Kievsky on June 05, 2011, 07:26 PM | #

Grimoire,

Thank you for your kind words.  Yes, you are on the right track to send the nationalist youth into ambulance/fire community service/volunteer constables et cetera.

What we need to do in America is have a wealthy underground that funds a few well spoken men and women with integrity who can speak for us all and sound good.  Just like Jacob Schiff funding Trotsky.  Trotsky didn’t care about “losing his job” he was backed by big Jew.  I even heard (though I don’t know if true) that he was married to a Rothschild woman.

We are finding that most white Americans are lazy and apathetic, and this is why we are being run over.  Only a contracting economy and the bite of hunger can awaken them from their anaesthesiac slumber.

Posted by Grimoire on June 05, 2011, 08:35 PM | #

Kievsky: Your welcome. May I say you do not need a wealthy individual to fund you. All you need to do is start and the money will come.

Posted by Lurker on June 05, 2011, 09:08 PM | #

It was me that described blacks as the figureheads of dance music. Dance music is portaryed as much ‘blacker’ than it actually is. As in most other parts of entertainment, we are led to believe that creativity is racially egalitarian, if not actually concentrated in black hands.

Posted by Wandrin on June 05, 2011, 10:10 PM | #

We calculate our losses at 100 per cent for the first 2500 patriots.

Bollox

Guerrilla warfare has proven that patience, technique, obtain success.

Quite

Posted by Lee John Barnes on June 06, 2011, 03:55 AM | #

1) The dance music scene is 99 % white - both in audience and in the people who make the music. Drum and Bass gigs are mainly white IN WHITE AREAS but attrack black audiences in BLACK AREAS. The DJ’s in most drum and bass clubs are white. So are the club owners. Clubs and club nights in France, Germany, ibiza, Spain etc are around 99 % white with almost 100 % white club DJ’s. Most white clubbers dont like blacks at club events as they cause trouble.

If you are from the dance scene you should know that.

2) House music doesnt come from America, it comes from Rave Music which was virtually 100 % white and began in Britain. It was virtually 100 % white until it evolved into genres like Urban and Drum and Bass which started to attract blacks to the events.

3) Nationalists should organise Hard Bass gigs via the nationalist kids they have funded to enable them to get the skills and equipment they need to become DJ’s and to give the kids money to organise the gigs for themselves. Nationalists should assist kids to form their own clubs, DJs and to organise their own nights. Its not rocket science is it - you financially assist the kids to create their own scene. 

4)  I agree that the aim of much of contemporary culture is to condition youth via propaganda - but the weakeness of such a system is that you can undermine it by using the conditioning process for nationalism. That means rather than trying to impose on kids who have been conditioned a music they are not interested in, you create forms of music they are familiar with and subvert the music itself - you insert in words, slogans, concepts and ideas within the music they like - and hence they absorb it.

The problem with nationalists is that even though they are aware of the issue and power of conditioning ( eg the role of Freuds daughter in advertising, the Frankfurt School and Herbert Marcuse and media conditioning ) what do nationalists do - they spend all their time fighting against the conditoning.

INSTEAD OF REALISING THAT YOU CANNOT DEFEAT CONDITIONING AND THAT ALL YOU CAN DO IS SUBVERT IT, the nationalists insist on trying to impose their views and ideas on the conditioned masses.

When nationalists starting thinking for a moment, instead of talking shite like the idiots like Alex Linder on the VNN Forum, they would realise that subverting conditioning via using the conditioning process to disseminate our messages is the way forward.

It can be explained like this.

The media condition kids to like dance music by pumping it out all the time on the TV and at clubs.

The music they pump is full of anti-nationalist messages and images.

So what do nationalists do - they either ignore the power of music totally or they try and sell to the kids music they do not like or have been conditioned to hate eg skinhead music or classical music.

It makes me laugh when you see nationalists saying to kids ‘you should listen to Mozart and take up country dancing ’ - yeah like most teenagers are gonna do that.

What nationalists dont ever do, as they are too thick mostly, is to create nationalist forms of popular music.

If they created nationalist variants of popular music that carry nationalist messages, then the conditioned masses would accept it unthinkingly as they have been pre -conditioned to do so.

If nationalists created nationalist variants of whatever popular culture is peddling to the masses, the nationalist memes would be able to be spread easily into the minds of the masses as they have already been conditioned to accept those forms of popular culture.

SUBVERT THE CONDITIONING - DONT FIGHT THE CONDITIONING.

Nationalists want to fight conditioning - and hence they lose time after time, decade after decade as nationalist memes are not strong enough to compete against and win non-nationalist memes being pumped out and spread via the conditioning process.

You can only subvert conditioning, you cannot defeat it until we take power and control the tools and mechanisms of the conditioning process within society - the schools, the media and culturally creative forces in society.

I cant believe I am the only person who sees this fundamental truth.

Fucking nationalists - they spend all their time peering backwards into the past instead of innovating and looking to the future.

Posted by Bill on June 06, 2011, 06:12 AM | #

Apocalypse Now? - by Justin Raimondo, June 06, 2011

http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2011/06/05/apocalypse-now/

State capitalism, or corporate socialism, cannot sustain itself [.pdf]: it needs the constant pump-priming of the Federal Reserve to maintain the kind of mindless momentum required to keep the economy in motion. Eventually, this course will take us to the dead end of a worthless dollar and slavery to the banks – to whom we’ll be paying interest on borrowed money unto eternity. In the short term, however, the politicians and interest groups that profit from Big Government will maintain their power, perks, and privileges – and the short term is all they know or care about. So their battle cry is: keep those government printing presses rolling! Keep “stimulating” the corpse of the economy, so that it assumes the illusion of life – and get ready to create a lot more human corpses, if necessary, because war is a “stimulant.”

Posted by Leon Haller on June 06, 2011, 08:59 AM | #

Several comments worth responding to. Graham Lister first.

Graham,

Where do I begin, and should I? I’m much too busy to write something lengthy, as I did already in comment #1, but your comment on June 04, 2011, 09:33 PM | # is both fundamentally correct, yet filled with mistakes of economic history. Oy! Should I/ shouldn’t I, should I/ shouldn’t ...

Yes I’m not really down with this love of the right-wing, dog eat dog, neo-liberal economic/social model. If an ethnically and culturally homogenous society is valuable then it is a collective good. It cannot be defended, in any serious way, by the nostrums of liberal individualism. That would be a category error. Hayekian liberalism in this context is dumb beyond belief. (GL)

Let me just start by alluding to a compliment that I was going to pay you on the Grimoire article thread; namely, that you read real books (one can tell that too many MR commenters do not, preferring internet snippets to sustained engagement with serious texts). Scruton, Modern Philosophy, Kolakowski, Main Currents of Marxism, Paxton, Anatomy of Fascism - I have ‘em all. I’ve even considered getting the Bonner book, but you’re right - the equations are too intimidating for non-experts like me.

Given that you read widely and well, might I suggest that you actually read some serious capitalist theory (not Ayn Rand, though her novels, which are all I’ve read of hers, do have their uses - not as literature, but as skewerings of left-liberal hypocrisy and exposes of the corruption which grows out of state/capitalist collusions). You sneer at Hayek. I, too, find him overly, well, liberal (and ironically, both weakly Austrian and insufficiently libertarian - if you study the tradition, you’ll know what I mean). But have you read, to take his most famous political works, The Road to Serfdom, The Constitution of Liberty, or The Fatal Conceit?

Better still, you (and other conservatives and nationalists) need to fully absorb the vital insights into economic processes discovered by the classical liberals and later libertarians if you wish to construct a countervailing ethnocollectivist economic model. I am working on this myself, and discussed these issues here at MR last year (I really have to keep files on my comments). Indeed, I hope one day to write a book on Nationalist Economics. At the risk of disappointing you, however, be forewarned: Austro-libertarian (Menger, Mises, Hayek) microeconomics is clearly correct. Period. There are technical reasons for the overwhelming superiority of capitalism (the purer the better) to every form of socialism and state planning, involving economic calculation (Mises), and the uncollectibility of dispersed, particular knowledge (Hayek), in addition to the old conservative psychologistic incentives problem.

Read Rothbard, Man, Economy and State (for economics), and Mises, Human Action (for a comprehensive methodological individualist view of the problem of scarcity and human society). You could also try Riesman, Capitalism: A Treatise. These are all massive works, not easily read. But you cannot come away from them believing any more of this purely political/rhetorical “Third Way” garbage (whether of social democratic Left, or nationalist Right). (For a very stimulating if dry work expanding libertarian theory into new and mostly politically incorrect subjects, read Hoppe, Democracy: The God That Failed.)

We may nevertheless want a Third Way between socialism and capitalism, but we are pursuing it for non-economic reasons. Mixed economies will be, apodictically, materially poorer than capitalist ones.

I do think the Austrians can be challenged macroeconomically in two areas: ecology, and politics. Put another way, I criticize libertarians meta-economically. I refuse to expand on this here (or I’ll be writing all day). Perhaps you can intuit my criticisms. 

The Scandinavian model has produced high levels of prosperity and stable societies with high levels of social capital/social solidarity. Please note, our American friends, they are not ‘socialist’; they are market economies but with generally smart policies to build both social and economic capital. Unlike the UK with its housing bubble producing the illusion of prosperity, a never-ending population of immigrants in generally low-paid jobs to generate ‘economic growth’ and the organised spivary of finance capital. (GL)

Utter rubbish. The Scandinavian model is/was a total failure on every level - from economic prosperity, to fiscal solvency, to nuclear-family breakdown, to falling indigenous populations, to decline of religion, to loss of traditional values, to imposition of multiculturalism and liberal immigration (anybody recall the Danish cartoons episode? hello? Muslims in Copenhagen in Viking times?). They were total squanderers of both “social and economic capital” (read Swedish-American conservative Allan Carlson on his ancestral homeland’s social disaster).

You are a scientist, right? Correlation does not equal causation - ring any bells? Such prosperity as Scandinavia enjoyed in the postwar period was due to their inherited social and economic capital from their pre-socialist, traditionalist past; genetic, Nordic superiority; and their being allowed to parasite off American taxpayers providing their defense (something dismayingly true for all Europeans, the French and British somewhat excepted).

Let me ask a simple question to people especially of the more libertarian bent. Imagine you can live in a time like the USA in 1954 or in the USA of 2004. As a white I would pick a 1954 style society every time. Guess what marginal tax rates for the wealthy were up to 90% - Government was pretty big back then too.(GL)

Graham Lister, PhD? “Piled higher and deeper”? How many errors of fact and implication does this contain? I really don’t want to count the ways ...

You don’t know much about American economic history, do you? Yes, I’d rather live in America circa 1954 than 2011. That is because America in ‘54 was whiter, more Christian (old-school, not weirdo evangelical), more ethical, more civilized, more eugenic, less crowded, more segregated, less sexualized, less culturally degraded ... and more prosperous, in part because it had a much, much, much smaller government, in both absolute size, and regulatory scope, than is the case today.

Take one fact among many I could offer. In 2000, the US Federal Govt consumed 18% of GDP. Barely over a decade later, that number has risen to an unprecedented 24%! Govt in 1954 was ‘big’ by pre-New Deal standards; it was tiny compared with today’s. And though the Fed tax code was more progressive then, as you correctly point out, its overall tax take was far smaller, not to mention at the state level, where it was relatively much smaller still.

The US has never been as socialist as it is today; its govt at all levels has never been larger or more costly; it is govt economic strangulation, made far worse by Obongo, which is why the US cannot lead the world out of recession. We need much more capitalism, not still less. 

So what has happened since 1954? - Well it is often noted that the ‘right’ won the economic arguments and the ‘left’ the cultural ones. But as Adam Curtis argues his documentary “The Century of the Self” these developments are two sides of the same coin. The coin of individualistic liberalism. To put it crudely the ‘left’ version of this ideology undermines traditional social and cultural norms. So do it in the road if it feels good, be a LSD dropping libertine homosexual, be a sluttish woman that fucks a different black every night if you want to etc., it’s your ‘right’ as an sovereign individual. And on the ‘right’ well if can we can cynically profit from something we will…so let’s go with the trashy mass-culture (you want porn 24/7 here you go) and if it keeps the profits flowing, yes lets have the millions of Mexicans please (and fuck Euro-America, if it ends up destroying them so long as we make a buck who cares?). It’s your ‘right’ as a sovereign individual to make as much money as possible – not matter how toxic the effects are upon the common good and the historical well of social capital. Markets can have extremely negative consequences, they can radically undermine the genuine things of value that sustain a healthy culture. Markets must serve the health of society not the other way around. Knowing the price of everything but the value of nothing is a big part of the reason why Western world is in the position it now faces. (GL)

Bullshit. The Left won nearly everything. Trust me. I know a lot about modern American history and politics. Even the American Right has never been wholly libertarian. It has never embraced mass immigration (except for the fools at the otherwise excellent Wall Street Journal), drug legalization or pornography. It has been pro-military, and aggressively anti-communist.

Your criticism is really directed at the cowardly modern Republican party, which serves the (misperceived, short-term) interests of the large corporations and hangers-on.

Clinton and Bush Junior are separated by secondary ‘expressive’ issues but on all the key functional issues are in agreement (the two sides of the political class have far more in common with each other than with with us plebs both functionally and ideologically).  The political class of America is now, more or less openly, a hostile class to their own population. Right and left liberalism are two cheeks on the same behind – the same butt that is defecating all over the genuine long-term well-being of the vast majority of Euro-Americans. (GL)

This I mostly agree with, though Americans better not believe the ‘two-sides of the same coin’ stuff too intently. Bad as I regard the GOP, they are light years better than the awful Democrats. It is literally vital to my own well-being and that of countless other Old Stock Americans that we defeat Obama next year. There is a lot riding on this.

I have lived in both Minnesota and Texas and the vast majority of everyday Euro-Americans I encountered were polite, decent, helpful, civil and generally nice people (far more that in England which is the most culturally and socially degraded nation in the Western world). The demographic crisis facing them is real and more pronounced that in any other Western nation, but the USA is practically a colony of Israel these days due both to our Jewish ‘friends’ and self-serving traitorous elites so the longer-term prospects look rather bleak.(GL)

I think this is exaggerated, on two grounds. First, are we as bad off demographically as some European countries? Especially benelux? Are we worse off than New Zealand (probably)? England sounds pretty bad. Second, I think white Americans today, degraded as we are, are still tougher and more independent, and thus more prepared to deal with diversity and collapse than you Europeans, who seem like the weakest people of all time. There are many more conservative Americans, both in absolute and relative terms, than there are rightists in the various European nations. And we are mostly further to the right than your own conservatives.

Any ethnocentric politics, to my mind, must be build around the ‘radical center’ than can appeal to both men and women, the blue-collar worker and the professional. Intelligently collectivist and communitarian, profoundly contemptuous of every form of the destructive ultra-liberalism (right and left) that, thus far, has been the evermore powerful and hegemonic shaper of modernity. A synthesis of the best of right and left traditions in order to protect our collective and individual well-being, understanding the profound interdependence of the latter on the former, and looks beyond mere survival to our renewed flourishing as European people. A politics and culture which from the lowliest street-sweeper to the highest scientist recoginses their profound value and dignity because they are OUR people.

And just to finish, should we ever live in genuinely revolutionary times, personally I would not be unhappy to see the rounding up every ‘follower’ of that Jewish bitch Ann Rand (aka Alisa Zinov’yevna Rosenbaum whom, of course, pushed the idea, for the goyim at least, that we have no collective identity, history, interests and so on and thoughts of such are the highest form of evil), and the administration of desperately needed ‘retrospective abortions’ for the self-styled ‘objectivists’.l(GL)

Read Kirk, The Conservative Mind, and imagine it incorporating honesty about race and genetics, and you have my own long term scholarly project.

Posted by Leon Haller on June 06, 2011, 09:31 AM | #

Posted by Grimoire on June 04, 2011, 09:56 PM | #

There is the possibility of a end run around the system

————————————————————————-

Grimoire,

Thanks for the compliment. And yes, your list of hates is mine, too.

But I cannot agree with this:

This type of movement, -540 degree’s counter to everything that has come before - has a possibility of universal attraction.

This reminds me of arguments I’ve had with Silver, and my response is the same. Let us not be naive. Our competitor races are not neo-Wilsonian (you study American history, no?) “national idealists”, caring about equal self-determination for all. They want what is ours (land, wealth, women), and will happily take it if we continue to let them. Alliances between racial nationalists of different races are inherently self-defeating. Why would some African or Arab or Mexican want to be master in his own shitty country, when he can be master (and live the High Life) in ours?

Nobody is going home of his own accord. He must be pushed.

Posted by Leon Haller on June 06, 2011, 10:00 AM | #

Kievsky,

Thank you, and thanks for the original post.

Though I myself have suffered in the downturn, I guess I just fail to see the desperation you do. Our racial plight is bad enough; why must people exaggerate other matters?

I’m not anti-farmer, far from it (except for those parasites living off taxpayer subsidies). I think involvement, esp of white youth, in local agricultural projects would be a socially and culturally excellent trend. The modern world is highly alienating from the normal rhythms of existence. Increasing awareness of those rhythms can only help.

I’m not sure of the economic viability of local farming. Of course, if the goal is just to produce enough crops to feed oneself and pay off any debts incurred for purchase of seeds and fertilizer, then maybe it would work. Right now, I don’t know if these farms would be competitive with the large scale agriculture which has made America a leading food exporter. Americans won’t starve, because, as I pointed out, there is so much inefficiency built into the system that could be immediately eliminated (eg, ethanol subsidies, which would instantly free up much corn for the market).

More broadly, the American job market is crap because of Obama and his policies. I hate to sound ‘mainstream’, but just vote GOP; if we take the Senate, you will start to see improvements.

We are not like our brothers in South Africa, instantly at the mercy of useless savages. We have tremendous know-how, and lots of white people, with lots of resources. But we have fiscal problems and business uncertainty due to Obama. Remember, the natural course of a free market economy is to grow. If we are stagnating or declining it is due to poor management - which we can get rid of.

And you’re from CT? CT has huge amounts of money! Every person but one I’ve know from CT was rich.

Posted by Leon Haller on June 06, 2011, 10:51 AM | #

Graham_Lister said:

What greater honour is there than to die for England, to give the unborn the freedom to forever live, love, laugh and cry with their own kind, in England. Our ancestors did no less. (Foundation)

————————————————————————————————

Great spirit, but cunning can often be the better part of valor. Don’t be stupid. Don’t be attracted to a politics of romantic and futile gestures. The ‘yobs’ won’t care. The Muslims will laugh. The commoners will be still more dispirited.

True British revolutionaries would be urban guerillas. They would attack mosques (remote ones first), Islamic ‘community centres’, any sort of NWO “racial sensitivity” bureaucracy - but NOT police or (legitimate) governmental bodies, let alone anything to do with ordinary Englishmen. Even better would be targeted assassinations of known race traitors in the media, universities and general culture. If authors publishing multiculti trash in the nation’s newspapers were routinely assassinated within days of publication, a very pungent message would get heard very quickly. Of course, thanks to the traitor Blair, Britain is now the most surveilled country on Earth, so this might not be easy ...

But do not try to start a war anytime soon. I’m sorry (and I am a foreigner mostly ignorant of the present English situation), but I do not believe the conditions are right for such actions to accomplish anything more than getting a number of good men needlessly killed.

Posted by Kievsky on June 06, 2011, 01:14 PM | #

Leon,

I have figured out how to grow good, organic food as cheaply as possible by tapping into the waste stream of horse manure and grass clippings.  Organic matter is most important input into growing fruits and vegetables.  Nowadays people just throw it away, and eat 3000 miles Caesar salads.  Even human excrement can be heated and ground up (in compost toilets) and applied as a very good soil amendment.  But it’s all wasted.

The food supply is highly leveraged.  It not only requires good harvests, but a reliable transportation system.  People are dangerously dependent on this, but htey won’t figure this out until its too late.

Posted by Revolution Harry on June 06, 2011, 05:49 PM | #

2) House music doesnt come from America, it comes from Rave Music which was virtually 100 % white and began in Britain. It was virtually 100 % white until it evolved into genres like Urban and Drum and Bass which started to attract blacks to the events.

House music originated in Chicago and got its name from one of the clubs there called the Warehouse. In the late eighties it arrived in England via Ibiza where it took off and in its early incarnation was largely referred to as ‘Acid House’. The term ‘Rave’ was never really a descriptive term applied to the music as such but more to the events themselves. I could list scores of early black (and Hispanic) Dj’s and music producers such as Larry Levan, Frankie Knuckles, Tony Humphries, Marshall Jefferson, Larry Heard and Marshall ‘Jackmaster’ Funk. From my recollection I’d say the crowds at early house nights were probably reflective of the ethnic make up of England at the time. That is to say around 5% or so were black.

Posted by Revolution Harry on June 06, 2011, 06:43 PM | #

That’s not to say that I don’t appreciate that the whole house music scene was testament to the inventiveness and creativity of the native English youth. It was them that drove the development of it and spread it around the world.

Posted by John on June 07, 2011, 05:26 PM | #

There is no reason a black or Indian artist who advocates returning to Africa or India or the Moon shouldn’t be recognized, respected, encouraged and promoted. We’d be insane not to. We’d be insane to turn away anyone who shares our basic beliefs - immigrants go home and clean up your own mess….corrupt politicians, your ticket is invalid, compromised political systems - we can’t hear you, armed police surveillance state - you’ve been hacked, national military - hows the holiday in Afghanistan? Cultural Marxists - fuck off we’re sick of you…and btw. say hello to my little friend.

If the genie gives you a coke it’ll be because you fought for it—almost to a man with everyone whose presence in your territory would make you wish for anything else.

“Such prosperity as Scandinavia enjoyed in the postwar period was due to [...] their being allowed to parasite off American taxpayers providing their defense (something dismayingly true for all Europeans, the French and British somewhat excepted).”

Parasite my ass. Ever hear of a protection racket?

Posted by Leon Haller on June 07, 2011, 05:57 PM | #

A curious “protection racket” with absolutely zero benefit for American taxpayers, and without which you Euro-pansies would have been Sovietized many decades ago - and then you could have said au revoir to your precious 30 hour work weeks, labor coddling, socialist health schemes, sexual liberation, and unearned “dolce vita”.

The global role of Western Europeans since the 60s, with the honorable exception of Britain in the 80s, has been pernicious and pathetic.

“Where have all the soldiers gone?”

Indeed.

Posted by Graham_Lister on June 07, 2011, 08:33 PM | #

Yes because everyone knows that American foreign policy is total unselfish and altruistic - the power elites of Uncle Sam have nothing but good intentions - silly to think otherwise. Perhaps people should move on from the dumb Sarah Palin worldview – OK so you think Denmark is a ‘socialist hellhole’ we get it (maybe an educational visit to North Korea might be good to see what a real genuine socialist hellhole looks like).

And millions of white Americans surviving on food-stamps and millions without adequate health insurance (I believe the leading cause of personal bankruptcy in America is healthcare costs), well that is a really clever way of building up the social-capital and the potential solitary of a group rather than creating more intra-group frictions - not. Perhaps the idea that a family of modest means could live with a small amount of dignity and not completely hand to mouth, on the wages of a single breadwinner might not be such a bad idea. Maybe if moms could stay at home without impoverishing their families that would be social positive? But I’m no economist, so I guess the quality of family life can go to hell if ‘free-market’ demands it. Right? So lets all have work 70+ hours a week to have a moderate standard of living and well let the TV and the internet babysit the kids. Anything else is evil socialism - damn it!!!!

Look it’s up to Americans if they wish to accept and ‘enjoy’ a Hayekian/Randian ‘social order’ (if indeed the term social is even applicable).  But a couple of thoughts – it’s quite difficult to build social/political movements, especially based on defending some collective identity and at the same time signal to people you really don’t give a damn about them nor any of other social problems or issues which might afflict them, just so long as you’re doing OK everything’s good. You know I’m no expert in political science but I think a general demeanor of ‘beggar thy neighbour’, well that just might put quite a few people off.

And as much as the general level of civility etc., is much higher in the heartlands of the USA, than say my homeland of Scotland – at least my homeland is 98% European – and Denmark is similar – what is the percentage in the US again?

Tim Wise might be a lot of things, but in that ‘Letter to the White Right’ he was correct in stating that the demographic clock is ticking down really fast in the USA – at a far more rapid rate than any other Western nation - it’s 5 minutes to midnight and you still want to bitch about your marginal tax rates and how the GOP is still kinda alright because despite all the empirical evidence to the contrary!

Did I get my history wrong or was the biggest amnesty (3 million or so) for illegal aliens enacted by that GOP ‘hero’ Ronnie Reagan? He also, as Governor of California, signed off on the first ‘no fault divorce’ legislation in American social history (my how conservative and supportive of the social fabric of society – is marriage just another ‘contract’ to walk out for any superficial reason?) as well as an extremely permissive law on abortion. Obviously abortion is a ‘necessary evil’ in some cases but which type of conservatism is it that promotes an maximalist policy on abortion?

Silly me thinking Republicans are, once elected, Hayekian liberals dressed up as conservatives. Sometimes I think we should simply call all of the Janus-faced variations of individualist liberalism the ‘American ideology’.

Posted by Leon Haller on June 08, 2011, 05:05 AM | #

The cogency of your posts is rapidly declining, Graham. I was actually going to discuss virtue v deontological ethics, per your request, but I’m now inclined to think that might be a waste of time. You really need to read some of the books I recommended, because you are very confused, esp wrt political economy and recent economic history, even if you do point to some failings in American conservatism (not that we American Hard Rightists aren’t well aware of these ourselves).

Posted by bubba on June 08, 2011, 08:01 PM | #

The cogency of your posts is rapidly declining, Graham…You really need to read some of the books I recommended, because you are very confused, esp wrt political economy and recent economic history, even if you do point to some failings in American conservatism

Despite Graham’s problems his last post was reasonable.  Perhaps he wasn’t in the mood to debate a narcissistic capitalist ideologist masquerading as a white nationalist?

Posted by Graham_Lister on June 08, 2011, 10:59 PM | #

Really so if one is not a hard-right Haykenian liberal on economic matters then one is an idiot?

OK I’m trained in the scientific method in one of the hard sciences. I try to observe the world and particular empirical phenomena. I test my hypothesis against observations generated using experimental techniques. I don’t wish away inconvenient observations – if my hypothesis fails I must adopt a new one. Real science is an open project – open to new information and evidence. Unlike some quasi-intellectual endeavors which shoehorn every observation into a cherished theory without any possibility of falsification. Such things are called ideologies. Which is OK so long as you don’t assume they actually track reality very well.

Firstly with regard to international relations I’m a realist – nations generally peruse realpolitik policies that their political elites think are necessary to advance their own interests. Altruism is not very high on the agenda of those foreign policy elites.

Back to the rather complex real world.

Let’s try a simple series of questions Leon

In real terms have median wages in the USA over the last 30 years declined, flat-lined, or grown? You know it’s a fairly simple empirical question Leon.

Another question – in the last ten years what was the average number of Euro-Americans, per year, that suffered personal bankruptcy due to their own or a dependents healthcare costs?

Again I’m not making any moral judgment about the answers - I simply want to know the facts. Leon surely you can answer those pretty simple empirical queries? Are they outragous questions? Am I a secret Commie for asking?

And on the market. Of course markets have social utility. I don’t see any complex society doing without them anytime soon. But they do have problems – ever hear of ‘externalities’ Leon?  The unrestricted free-market is not my God.  It is a human institution - so is flawed just as any human institution is. Moreover at a systematic level mass-markets are, at best, morally neutral. Corporations operating in the market, particularly in mass-consumerist societies will sell anything if it turns a profit and they can get away with it/generate demand via advertisement. It’s astonishingly naive to assume the market simply responses to bottom-up pre-existing demand and isn’t in the business of ‘trend innovation’ and the top-down expanding of our wants and creation of new demands.

For example look at the wonderful highbrow world of modern art. No real restriction from government on the production and sale of artwork. And it’s an exceptional example of toxic liberal pseudo-culture. So if some ‘artists’ can play the ‘Emperors new clothes trick’ on half-educated buffoons (with more money than sense) our artistic heritage can be happily and totally undermined by such brands as Damian Hirst, Jeff Koons, Robert Mapplethorpe et al., and their rancid anti-art? But hey the market decides all that shit is good so why worry about the attendant cultural pollution. And if in order to generate profits the artwork must become ever more ugly and offensive well that’s just the market at work, yes?

So trash culture frequently turns a profit – well unless society restricts the operation of the ‘free-market’ trash culture is what we will get. Too bad that culturally improvised people of all classes set the cultural tone for society at large. But hey the unfettered market is working the old magic so let’s celebrate modern art, vulgar television, disgusting fast food outlets every damn place, porn of everytype on tap 24/7, gangster rap and bondage gear for infants on sale in San Francisco et al. It’s all good. So long as someone wants it and will pay for it let’s go with it.

Liberal individualism really is a sort of ‘in the bonemarrow’ American ideology, yes?

Posted by Leon Haller on June 09, 2011, 08:09 AM | #

Perhaps he wasn’t in the mood to debate a narcissistic capitalist ideologist masquerading as a white nationalist? (bubba)

What a fucking idiot. After all my comments here, I have nothing to prove. On the other hand, who the fuck are you, even to be opening your mouth among your superiors? Go away.

Posted by Leon Haller on June 09, 2011, 08:24 AM | #

Graham,

You either did not read or understand the following (see esp sentences in bold):

You sneer at Hayek. I, too, find him overly, well, liberal (and ironically, both weakly Austrian and insufficiently libertarian - if you study the tradition, you’ll know what I mean). But have you read, to take his most famous political works, The Road to Serfdom, The Constitution of Liberty, or The Fatal Conceit?

Better still, you (and other conservatives and nationalists) need to fully absorb the vital insights into economic processes discovered by the classical liberals and later libertarians if you wish to construct a countervailing ethnocollectivist economic model. I am working on this myself, and discussed these issues here at MR last year (I really have to keep files on my comments). Indeed, I hope one day to write a book on Nationalist Economics. At the risk of disappointing you, however, be forewarned: Austro-libertarian (Menger, Mises, Hayek) microeconomics is clearly correct. Period. There are technical reasons for the overwhelming superiority of capitalism (the purer the better) to every form of socialism and state planning, involving economic calculation (Mises), and the uncollectibility of dispersed, particular knowledge (Hayek), in addition to the old conservative psychologistic incentives problem.

Read Rothbard, Man, Economy and State (for economics), and Mises, Human Action (for a comprehensive methodological individualist view of the problem of scarcity and human society). You could also try Riesman, Capitalism: A Treatise. These are all massive works, not easily read. But you cannot come away from them believing any more of this purely political/rhetorical “Third Way” garbage (whether of social democratic Left, or nationalist Right). (For a very stimulating if dry work expanding libertarian theory into new and mostly politically incorrect subjects, read Hoppe, Democracy: The God That Failed.)

We may nevertheless want a Third Way between socialism and capitalism, but we are pursuing it for non-economic reasons. Mixed economies will be, apodictically, materially poorer than capitalist ones.

I do think the Austrians can be challenged macroeconomically in two areas: ecology, and politics. Put another way, I criticize libertarians meta-economically. I refuse to expand on this here (or I’ll be writing all day). Perhaps you can intuit my criticisms.

Posted by Leon Haller on June 09, 2011, 09:12 AM | #

Your comment of June 9 is nothing but a huge series of straw men. I’m rather shocked you can’t seem to recognize this.

Really so if one is not a hard-right Haykenian liberal on economic matters then one is an idiot?(GL)

Yes, or an ignoramus.

Of course, I pointed out that the Austrians (Hayekians) can, I believe, be criticized wrt their political economy, but the criticisms are meta-economic, not economic. You don’t grasp the distinction, do you?

Let’s try a simple series of questions Leon

Again I’m not making any moral judgment about the answers - I simply want to know the facts. Leon surely you can answer those pretty simple empirical queries? Are they outragous questions? Am I a secret Commie for asking?(GL)

But what is the point of these questions? What are you trying to prove? Your method of argumentation is inadequate. Consider question 1. There is, one can dimly discern, an improper, implicit imputation that a defender of laissez-faire (understood as a system of economy, not political economy: the former deals with wealth maximization under conditions of scarcity, the latter with the economy understood as merely one component of the larger polity) would deny any negative assessment of the state of US wages in the recent past. But what justifies that imputation? Do you think a Hayekian (the proper term is “Austrian” or “Misesian”) denies reality? Why suppose that someone who favors free markets would say that wages have grown? Why suppose that, if wages have declined in the period under question, the culprit is the market - and not government-imposed or created deformations of the market (as is in fact the case?

And what is the point of the other two questions about Euro-Americans? To what are they relevant?

And on the market. Of course markets have social utility. I don’t see any complex society doing without them anytime soon. But they do have problems – ever hear of ‘externalities’ Leon?  The unrestricted free-market is not my God.  It is a human institution - so is flawed just as any human institution is. Moreover at a systematic level mass-markets are, at best, morally neutral. Corporations operating in the market, particularly in mass-consumerist societies will sell anything if it turns a profit and they can get away with it/generate demand via advertisement. It’s astonishingly naive to assume the market simply responses to bottom-up pre-existing demand and isn’t in the business of ‘trend innovation’ and the top-down expanding of our wants and creation of new demands.(GL)

No, markets qua markets do not have problems - except in the general sense that no human institution (as you note) is perfect. But you don’t understand the issue, which is not whether any human institution is or can be ‘perfect’, but whether markets are better than governments at wealth maximization (generating prosperity) - and the answer is overwhelmingly yes, as a matter both of (praxeo)logical deduction (read Mises and/or Rothbard, so you don’t continue embarrassing yourself), as well empirical demonstration (eg, North v South Korea, East v West Germany, Maoist China v Hong Kong or Taiwan, etc).

Yes, I understand the concept of ‘externalities’, though it has no relevance to public policy. Corporations attempting to commodify things which in your opinion should not be so treated is not an economic problem, let alone a failing of free markets. It may be a political problem, depending on one’s ideology. Lastly, I made no remark about trend innovation, nor do I have any objection to it, however. What is yours?

For example look at the wonderful highbrow world of modern art. No real restriction from government on the production and sale of artwork. And it’s an exceptional example of toxic liberal pseudo-culture. So if some ‘artists’ can play the ‘Emperors new clothes trick’ on half-educated buffoons (with more money than sense) our artistic heritage can be happily and totally undermined by such brands as Damian Hirst, Jeff Koons, Robert Mapplethorpe et al., and their rancid anti-art? But hey the market decides all that shit is good so why worry about the attendant cultural pollution. And if in order to generate profits the artwork must become ever more ugly and offensive well that’s just the market at work, yes?

So trash culture frequently turns a profit – well unless society restricts the operation of the ‘free-market’ trash culture is what we will get. Too bad that culturally improvised people of all classes set the cultural tone for society at large. But hey the unfettered market is working the old magic so let’s celebrate modern art, vulgar television, disgusting fast food outlets every damn place, porn of everytype on tap 24/7, gangster rap and bondage gear for infants on sale in San Francisco et al. It’s all good. So long as someone wants it and will pay for it let’s go with it.(GL)

I don’t support modern ‘art’ or ‘culture’, nor deny that it can turn a profit. Relevance to the issue of whether markets are better guarantors of prosperity than governments? I also have never stated that anything that markets do is nationally or socially or morally optimal. You are imputing to me views I have not advanced or defended (nor whose defense is implicit in anything I’ve said). 

Liberal individualism really is a sort of ‘in the bonemarrow’ American ideology, yes? (GL)

I have never defended liberal individualism, which is neither coincident nor coterminous with the economic case for free markets.

Posted by bubba on June 09, 2011, 10:29 PM | #

What a fucking idiot. After all my comments here, I have nothing to prove. On the other hand, who the fuck are you, even to be opening your mouth among your superiors? Go away.

- Leon Fink

Hi, I’m bubba.  Pleased to make your narcissist acquaintance.

You’re not a white nationalist.  Clear to all with a brain is you’re a capitalist ideologue pursuing racialism as a hobby.  Money first, second, and last. 

Simpletons may be impressed with you, but bubba ain’t.  Think I’ll stick around for awhile.

Good day, prig.

Posted by Silver on June 14, 2011, 06:57 PM | #

You are imputing to me views I have not advanced or defended (nor whose defense is implicit in anything I’ve said).

It is clearly implicit.

As for the side-by-side comparisons you made, all those “capitalist” countries enjoyed a level of government intervention that would make an Austrian’s skin crawl.  There are plenty of other examples around the world in which interventionist states enjoyed splendid rates of growth, too.  The belief that it “doesn’t work” (which I don’t ascribe to you but is commonplace among the libertarian rank and file) simply cannot be countenanced.

Ultimately, it is ideological: is it better to carry the bottom along with you, even if it requires sacrificing a bit of immediate growth, they being people after all?  Or better to let them eat cake and focus on what the short run can do for the rich?